Purpose: Through a conversation with a practitioner, aims to understand the definitions given to the learning organization and how they relate to a model of organizational learning. Design/methodology/approach: Provides a brief overview of a conversation concerning organizational learning vs the learning organization. Findings: Organizational learning and the learning organization can and should co-exist. To be effective as a learning organization there is a need for a deep learning cycle and recognition that it will take time. Originality/value: Offers advice on how to be an effective learning organization.